How can we move beyond just being “healthy” to living wisely?
In this episode of “Two Shrinks Over Drinks,” Nathan Chua sits down with Dr. Hank Robb, a seasoned psychotherapist from Portland, Oregon, and a prominent voice in Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT) and Relational Frame Theory (RFT).
Together, they dive deep into the philosophy of behaviorism, the limitations of the DSM “disease model,” and how small groups can drive large-scale societal change. Hank shares his unique perspective on making complex psychological concepts simple, digestible, and—most importantly—actionable for everyday life.
Key Topics Discussed:
[05:13] Technical Eclecticism: Why it’s okay to use diverse techniques but vital to stay grounded in a consistent theory.
[13:00] The Power of “We”: Moving from joint attention to joint intention in therapy and relationships.
[16:14] Creative Hopelessness: Understanding the transformation of stimulus functions—when letting go of a failing strategy opens the door to new opportunities.
[30:08] Misunderstandings of B.F. Skinner: A look at Skinner’s naturalism and why his denial of “supernaturalism” made him a controversial figure.
[53:30] Errors vs. Illness: Why focusing on “wisdom” and “wise choices” is often more helpful than traditional diagnostic labeling (DSM).
[01:03:00] Scaling Change: How principles from Eleanor Ostrom and small, value-driven groups can influence communities and even entire countries.
About Hank Robb: Hank Robb, Ph.D., ABPP, is the author of Willingly ACT for Spiritual Development. He is known for his ability to translate the dense language of RFT into practical metaphors that help clients “willingly acknowledge, willingly choose, and willingly teach.”
About the Host: Nathan Chua is a counselor based in Quezon City, Philippines, and the author of Better People, Better Country.
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https://open.spotify.com/episode/7vnTD2k876ZMhfRi9A8VPn?si=SqFBTbaKSdek3pnVqSVrng